Each kiss begins with capital punishment on this different world drenched in black and white from writer-director duo Alexandre Singh and Natalie Musteata. Two Folks Exchanging Saliva is a dystopian queer love story set in a actuality the place individuals pay for objects with a various variety of slaps to their face and the place getting caught kissing is a loss of life sentence. The story facilities on Angine (Zar Amir), an prosperous however sad girl who compulsively outlets in a luxurious division retailer. Over the course of a number of visits, she turns into intrigued by Malaise (Luàna Bajrami), an enthralling younger shopgirl for whom Angine is keen to almost defy the prohibition on kissing. The 2 should determine the best way to domesticate their curiosity in one another whereas sneaking beneath the radar of Malaise’s suspicious colleague.
The 36-minute brief, additionally narrated by Vicky Krieps, has taken dwelling a number of awards throughout numerous festivals that embody AFI’s Grand Jury Prize, the Golden Gate Mid-Size Movie Award from the San Francisco Movie Competition, Finest Drama Brief from Out on Movie in Atlanta, and each the Canal+ and viewers awards on the Clermont-Ferrand Brief Movie Competition.
Beneath, Singh and Musteata communicate to Deadline about riskily filming in Paris, the issue with kissing and making a world of harm and hard love.
DEADLINE: So, what’s so flawed with kissing? The place did this concept for the brief come from?
NATALIE MUSTEATA: That’s so fascinating, everybody at all times asks concerning the slapping. The kissing happened as a response to violence being a type of cost. As we have been writing, there have been many disturbing occasions occurring on this planet. Certainly one of them was the Girl, Life, Freedom motion in Iran, which was disturbing and galvanizing whereas all these younger individuals have been within the streets protesting this unjust, aggressive regime. There was this information story a couple of younger couple [Astiyazh Haghighi and her fiancé, Amir Mohammad Ahmadi] who had been dancing in entrance of the Freedom Tower [also known as the Azadi Tower] in Tehran and had been arrested and sentenced to 10 years in jail. We thought, “How is it potential that we reside in a world the place this could occur?” It’s so absurd. Then that became the concept that kissing is forbidden, as a result of perhaps on this world of our brief movie, violence is normalized, and intimacy isn’t.
ALEXANDRE SINGH: You see loads of authoritarian regimes the place sure kinds of love or queer love are repressed. We wished to show that round by taking an act that, in Western society, individuals simply settle for as being very regular. Which, if you consider it, might be thought-about gross, sticking your tongue into another person’s mouth and exchanging saliva. It’s one thing that would simply be twisted and made to really feel unusual. There are various issues that we do in our society that we settle for fully, that, if we took a step again, may really feel unusual to different cultures.
MUSTEATA: It was our manner of speaking about how absurd it’s to repress any kind of affection, as a result of telling somebody to not love is like telling somebody to not breathe. It’s so unstoppable, so attempting to suppress it’s absurd. The Seed of the Sacred Fig was additionally one among our favourite movies from final yr, and it hit us so exhausting as a result of it tackled the Girl, Life, Freedom motion. The motion is why we ended up working with Zar Amir Ebrahimi because the lead of our movie, regardless that it’s not evident within the movie that there’s a connection to Iran.
SINGH: Neither is the movie on its floor a political movie. It doesn’t put on it on its sleeve. Nonetheless, we thought it might be great to make this connection to this cinema and to this political motion that has influenced us, and by casting Zar, who would say all the pieces that we have to say, after which let the viewers draw their very own conclusions from that.
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DEADLINE: How did you discover Zar’s co-star Luàna Bajrami and get Vicky Krieps to do the narration?
SINGH: We noticed Luàna in Portrait of a Woman on Hearth. We have been already followers of hers, however it additionally occurred a bit by probability: our script was circulating at this company in France, and she or he got here throughout it. I imagine she had reached out to us, being like, “I need to be on this movie.” And we met her and liked her.
MUSTEATA: The movie was designed initially to have a voiceover. Voiceover is such a controversial topic, however there’s so many motion pictures that we love that use it from the Coen brothers, Barry Lyndon and Sentimental Worth. Our voiceover will not be important to the story; it doesn’t provide you with expository data or inform you how this world works, however, tonally, it’s extremely necessary to us. It was about establishing what sort of movie we’re getting into. There was a second the place we edited the movie with out the voiceover simply to see if it labored, and it did. We simply actually missed the voiceover, which is to say that Vicky got here on late within the movie course of.
SINGH: We wished her. It’s a French movie, however our leads are Iranian and from Kosovo, so we actually wished to point out a France that’s multicultural and cosmopolitan. We actually wished a voice talking French, with a slight accent that wasn’t fairly French.
MUSTEATA: We’ve additionally been huge followers of Vicky’s since Phantom Thread. There’s nearly one thing ethereal about her, and so we waited [for her to become available]. She’s not one of the best with e mail, so we gave the script to her agent, who saved attempting to provide it to her, however she was almost unreachable for thus lengthy. We nearly gave up, however lastly we obtained a response on the final potential second we needed to think about her involvement earlier than we nearly flirted with the thought of transferring on to another person. Fortunately, we didn’t need to, and she or he stated sure, so we met her in Berlin at a recording studio.
SINGH: We obtained a Letterboxd overview of the movie the place some French particular person stated, “Vicky, are you able to please narrate my life?”
DEADLINE: Would you want to clarify the very scientific method to your brief movie title?
MUSTEATA: Vicky was partially answerable for the title, Two Folks Exchanging Saliva.
SINGH: The movie has quite a lot of robust, daring choices, and a few of them occurred as a result of we have been transferring so shortly. We had this little window of time wherein we have been going to shoot, and so there wasn’t time to second-guess ourselves. However in post-production, we had a bit extra time, began second-guessing ourselves, and didn’t know what the movie’s title needs to be.
MUSTEATA: We had extra romantic concepts, like The Lips of One other, which actually sounds prefer it might be a movie by Almodóvar. But it surely simply felt so romantic and in no way absurd. We have been like, “Nicely, our movie is romantic and absurd, so how can we encapsulate that into one title and actually push the tonality of the movie, which could be very bizarre, and there’s a coldness, a medical facet to it as properly?” After we chanced upon Two Folks Exchanging Saliva, I imply, it’s form of one of many traces within the movie. It simply felt so proper. However our producers thought it was ugly. They saved telling us it sounded good in English however ugly in French. Then the English individuals have been like, “It sounds nice in French however horrible in English.” And we have been like, “It’s not meant to sound lovely; it’s meant to make you get up and see it.”
So, Vicky advised us that if she noticed a movie competition program with a movie like that, she would need to see it, and she or he [joked] that she wish to be in a movie known as that. With out skipping a beat, our Italian producer stated, “Vicky, you will be within the movie with that title.” And that’s the way it occurred.
DEADLINE: Why was filming in black and white necessary?
MUSTEATA: There are various completely different causes the movie is in black and white. But it surely was one thing we determined very early on, after we knew we’d shoot on this retailer. A part of the reason being that we needed to method this virtually as a result of we have been taking pictures in the course of the evening, and each morning now we have to return the shop to its regular look. So, we couldn’t rework the shop in a radical manner, however having it in black and white allowed us to place our personal aesthetic stamp on it and likewise scale back visible noise.
SINGH: A part of that visible discount is that it reveals you ways issues actually are, as a result of shade can distract you from seeing how issues really are. The constructing was a financial institution within the Thirties, and in black-and-white, you’ll be able to actually see that construction. It feels very chilly and austere. We actually wished to spotlight the geometry that’s already there, however it may get misplaced amongst all the colours within the retailer. We have been additionally fairly impressed by Wim Wenders’ Wings of Need, which has an iconic scene within the Berlin State Library. In black and white, all the pieces is so ethereal, robust and delightful. Our background is in visible artwork, so we predict very compositionally about framing. Additionally, there’s not a lot dialogue, so it nearly looks like a silent movie.
DEADLINE: Toothpaste is banned, and slaps function foreign money. Speak extra about that.
MUSTEATA: We had quite a lot of enjoyable with these guidelines. The movie is impressed by the absurdities in our personal world and by real-world political occasions.
SINGH: However on the identical time, the premise is ridiculous. You may say it’s foolish, however we deal with it as if it was very severe, and for the characters residing on this world, it’s very severe. So, after we created these guidelines, it was pure to suppose, “Nicely, what could be the implications of those guidelines?” So, for instance, with the slapping, individuals get slapped after they pay for stuff. Rich individuals would get slapped extra actually because they purchase extra stuff, which prices extra. Ultimately, their cheeks are going to get uncooked, pink and bruised. However as we all know in our society, indicators of wealth, even when they’re unfavourable, develop into indicators of energy. So, individuals would go round form of exhibiting off how bruised they have been. As we all know in our society, workers in shops who aren’t rich would in all probability have to color bruises on their faces to look rich. And so, this all comes from a foolish little thought, however then you definately form of take into consideration how human beings behave and the way that operates. So, if kissing is illegitimate, individuals wouldn’t need to be kissed. So, they might attempt to have unhealthy breath. So, they smoke so much, eat quite a lot of onions and eat a ton of garlic.
MUSTEATA: We have now individuals consuming uncooked onions as they wait in line earlier than they go to work, breath checks, individuals don’t brush their enamel, and toothpaste is outlawed. We form of simply took every thought and let our imaginations run somewhat wild with the repercussions of these guidelines and the way they might have an effect on society.
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DEADLINE: The movie primarily takes place within the Galeries Lafayette division retailer, after which there’s a scene within the Champs-Élysées. Speak a bit extra about these filming places and the challenges they introduced.
MUSTEATA: Each have been difficult, however with the Galeries Lafayette, the entire mission began with us figuring out we had entry to this in any other case very troublesome place to get. They have been actually on board, on our facet for all the pieces, and by no means interfered creatively in any way. The difficult half was that we had been in pre-production through the day up till the final minute, the day of our shoot, after which we simply went straight into working and taking pictures in the course of the evening. And so simply by way of bodily stamina, that was very, very difficult.
SINGH: The Champs-Élysées, you’re really not allowed to shoot there. You can’t even get a allow to shoot on the Champs-Élysées. I believe, except you’re Mission Unattainable, they’ll make an exception [laugh]. You need to be world-famous. But it surely was actually necessary for us to seize a number of the actual world to floor the story so it didn’t really feel prefer it simply occurred on this weird retailer the place the foundations have been completely different. So, we shot on the subway with a handheld digicam. We needed to be actually inconspicuous. We simply shot as we moved from one location to a different, actually impromptu.
MUSTEATA: We have been so afraid of getting stopped by the police that we solely had time to shoot it as soon as. It began raining, which is harmful for the digicam. There have been all these individuals within the scene, and for those who’re actually paying consideration, you’ll discover there’s one man for just a few frames who seems to be on the digicam and smiles, like, “What’s happening right here?”
DEADLINE: The brief has been making the rounds from AFI to SCAD to Telluride to Outfest and taking dwelling some awards. What do you suppose persons are responding to?
SINGH: We made this movie with our hearts, which we predict is admittedly necessary in any movie. We at all times have wild and loopy concepts that come naturally to us. That’s who we’re.
MUSTEATA: We really feel that if there isn’t catharsis in movie, then one thing is lacking.
SINGH: I believe we felt very sincerely, very tender emotions in the direction of these characters, and that’s one thing that we tried to infuse the movie with. I hope that for the individuals who actually join with the movie, they join with these two ladies, really feel the love they’ve for each other, and see the way it’s snuffed out. For instance, the way in which Angine tries however doesn’t dare, is form of cowardly. It’s about how individuals change their conduct in response to others’ expectations. I believe that resonates with their experiences of the world. It’s an absurd story, however the way in which the human beings on this world behave is identical as in our world.
MUSTEATA: I believe there’s a type of WTF to the movie too that individuals actually love, and it’s humorous. There’s an emotional connection that individuals actually reply to. It was one of many hardest issues about writing and making this movie was threading that needle between the humorous, the darkish, the form of whimsical, the craziness, however then additionally this very honest, tender story.
[This interview has been edited for length and clarity]
